ND football has just hit a new low. And although he may not have been fired just yet, Charlie Weis just took one step out the door with Saturday’s unbelievable head-scratching loss to Navy. The only thing that can save him now is to win the next 3 games (at Pitt, UConn, at Stanford) AND the bowl game. But right now, the chances of that miracle happening look quite slim given the team’s morale will likely hit rock bottom right before going into a lion’s den at #13 Pittsburgh next week. And as I said prior to the season, Notre Dame would have to go at least 9-3 and look good doing it for Charlie to keep his job, especially given the relatively weak schedule. Well, the Irish (6-3) are now guaranteed to be no better than 9-3 and have actually looked bad doing it (ND could easily be 3-6). And just when Notre Dame fans think it can’t get any worse (2007 home loss to Navy), it does (2008 home loss to Syracuse), and right after we’ve picked ourselves up and dusted off, the bus runs us over again (today’s loss). Confounding home losses to far less talented teams are now Charlie’s trademark, and that is completely unacceptable. I believe that AD Jack Swarbrick will be secretly contacting the following coaches before Sunday mass: Cincinati’s Brian Kelly, Boise State’s Chris Peterson, and TCU’s Gary Patterson. Although I guess it really won’t be much of secret, will it?
All of Notre Dame’s weaknesses came into play and contributed to Saturday’s defeat.
AP Photo/Darron CummingsTerrible defense: The Irish gave up 348 yards rushing to a team that is an entirely one-dimensional running team for an average of 6.1 yds/rush, including 158 yards to THE FREAKIN’ FULLBACK!!! But wait, Navy also connected on two whole passes for a total of 56 yards and a back-breaking TD. Shoddy tackling combined with missed assignments in leading to a terrible performance. Since Navy’s offense is a bit quirky, this might be understandable if ND played Navy once a decade or so, but we play them EVERY FREAKIN’ YEAR!! We know exactly what they’re gonna do, yet we seem totally surprised most of the game.
Awful Red Zone offense: How can a team gain over 500 yards and record 31 first downs, but score just two TDs (ignoring the one after the desperation on-side kick) … both in the 2nd half and lose the game? By looking great between the 20’s and failing miserably inside the 10, that’s how. Anyone tired of seeing the endless stream of corner fade patterns to Tate or Floyd? Whatever happened to the middle of the end zone and our talented tight end? Or a skinny post by Floyd? Early in the 2nd quarter, ND had a first and goal from Navy’s 2 yard line. Instead of bull-dozing it in, ND elected to run wide with the not-very- fast Robert Hughes and they lost 2 yards. The 3rd down play from the 3 was another failed fade pattern to the corner. And of course the Irish failed on a key 4th down play and gave the ball back to Navy. No points. The first half was totally wasted as the Irish were shut out. Yes, they missed two FG’s, but the blame goes to the offense for failing to score TD’s after getting so deep into Navy territory. Deep red zone efficiency has haunted the Irish all season. Now how does that happen to a team with an offensive genius as it’s head coach??? Well … it’s because he’s NOT an offensive genius and ND definitely does not have any schematic advantage, contrary to prior thoughts. And too bad Michael Floyd’s head was doubling as his butt during some key points in the second half … and why is that?
Anyway, frustration levels have hit a new high. It’s just impossible to fathom LOSING YET ANOTHER GAME AT HOME TO A FAR LESS TALENTED TEAM. Unfortunately, Charlie Weis may be the very reincarnation (or relived nightmare) of Gerry Faust. I was a student at ND right in the middle of the Faust years (’82-86), so this is a really bad deja vu moment! Like Mr. Faust, Charlie Weis is a nice man and a very good-to-great recruiter, but had no head coaching experience prior to ND. And like Gerry Faust, Charlie has terribly underachieved with a whole bunch of talent on the roster. A lot of “these guys” — Clausen, Tate, Rudolph, Floyd, T’eo, McCarthy, Riddick, Smith, Williams, etc — will be playing on Sundays … very similar to “yesteryear guys” Beurlien, Pinkett, Brown, Thayer, Golic, Duerson, Carney, etc who played in the NFL but also managed to lose to Air Force four years in a row under Faust!!!
Much like those Faust teams, this current Notre Dame team is a squad that never quits playing, but isn’t quite sure HOW to play. For some reason, this team’s considerable heart far exceeds its brainpower. The team that never stops fighting doesn’t know how to tackle, how to run block, or where to be during critical junctures of most games. All these shortcomings despite having a Heisman-caliber QB, a stable of outstanding receivers and generally a roster chock full of 4 and 5 star recruits most of whom are sophs, juniors and seniors. I think it’s about time to cut bait on Weis and land the next Urban Meyer before somebody else does. I don’t care if we lose some recruits and players transfer. ND should be willing to risk that because I think we’re resigned to the gut feeling that next year will be no better than this one, even if Clausen stays. And this year was supposed to be THE YEAR since the schedule was quite favorable. Heck … Michigan beat us, but has 5 losses now. Even USC is looking merely average (by USC standards) and they also beat us. And now, another loss at home to Navy!!! NAVY!!! Here’s the bottom line: If ND cannot go 10-2 this year, with this schedule, with all this talent, THEN IT’S NEVER GONNA HAPPEN WITH THIS COACHING STAFF. Time to change out the guard … I think Swarbrick is on the phone right now.
Reader Interactions
Comments
Russellsays
OK. I admit that I did not watch the game this week. Heck, I thought that this would be a win so I went to watch a Div II game here in my home town. I could not believe when I got home and was watching the end of the LSU-Alabama game and the score scrolled accross the bottom of the screen. I had recorded the game and went back and looked at the fourth quarter. One word – pathetic. I had predicted a 9-3 season at the beginning of the year and any less would mean that I would vote for CW to hit the road. There is no way that ND will finish this year at 9-3. We are beat down and have Pit next week. I agree with Wally that the ND AD should be on the phone looking for a new coach. I still think Jon Gruden would be a good fit. We need someone with excitement and an athletic appearance to be the coach at ND. So long Charlie!
A lot of talk about a supposed “easy schedule” really perturbed me concerning ND. I don’t know where anyone thought Navy would be easy. EXTREMELY well coached. You’re right, Wally. That loss to the Skunkbears is now more glaring of the state of Weis’ ND than any other game IMO.
Charlie is an NFL coach. In both bball and football, the pros and collegiate play is so vastly different that coaches can no longer make the swtich unless well versed in both. Charlie is an NFL groomed guy – plain and simple to me. Let’s take a look at what HAS happened during Charlie Weis’ reign:
David Cutcliffe, former Tennessee off. coord. (I think) took Duke’s program, which inherited the nation’s longest losing streak, has turned them around from an ACC laughing stock to a legitimate threat every week. They’ve crushed NC State, beat UVA and Maryland. Not exactly great, but he’s taken a team that routinely was out of the game by halftime and now sits with a winning record in conference play at 3-2.
Al Golden at Temple is being sorely overlooked for what he’s done with that basement dwelling program. He also inherited a team with the nation’s longest streak. They had virtually no recruiting. Now, he is on pace to win the conference and has the nation’s 3rd or 4th leading rusher in YPG.
These guys have done so much more with way, way less than the resources Charlie and his staff have at ND.
I would actually stay away from trying to lure Meyer from Florida. It seems like he easily snatches up all Florida talent and recruiting does itself there. Could he do that at ND? The HS talent in Florida is elite to everyone else except Texas and Cali. Maybe Skip Holtz from ECU would be a good candidate.
Russellsays
This was left on my FB wall: …, this is my best Village People imitation: IN THE NAVY, yes you can sail the 7 seas; IN THE NAVY, yes you can put your mind at ease; IN THE NAVY, put Notre Dame down on their knee’s; IN THE NAVY.
Wally knows that I am not a ND Alumni but I have been a huge fan for over 25 years. I guess you could call me one of the thousands and thousands that make ND a school with a true national following. My oldest daughter is a freshman at Arkansas. Maybe I should give up on ND and just become a Razorback. Things are always exciting in the SEC. Please show CW the door and get a new coaching staff before you start losing fans!
This might not be the place to say it but…NAVY IS A GOOD TEAM. Let me try that again…NAVY IS A GOOD TEAM!
Don’t forget, OSU needed an interception on a 2pt. conversion to beat the Midshipmen at the Shoe. By the way, Navy gained 342 yards that day. Yes, it was split between passing and rushing, but they still gained over 300 yards. Navy beat Wake Forest two weeks ago without a pass. Before you roll your eyes, consider that the Demon Deacons have two OT losses this year (BC and Georgia Tech) and they lost by one to Miami. Navy has regularly qualified for bowls.
All that said, I have seen enough failed fades to the corner. Kel: “How many more times are they going to run that play before they realize it does not work?
The pass off Floyd’s back has to go down as one of the most frustrating ever.
Wallysays
Casey —
I agree that Navy is a good team. They are very well-coached, disciplined, tough, and they don’t make many mistakes. That’s almost the opposite of Notre Dame, but the Irish have so much more natural talent that they can actually stay on the field and compete with Navy. (How funny does that sound?) To be fair, I’ll also concede that the Irish have heart and don’t give up … similar to Navy. Now, if ND could possibly get the type of quality coaching that Navy has, combined with all the talent in South Bend, then the Irish would be a fixture in the Top 10 and truly competing for Nat’l Titles every third or fourth year. Sounds like the Holtz or Parseghian eras, doesn’t it?
Navy was so much better prepared to play that game yesterday than ND was …. and that’s really disappointing and unacceptable. Strategy, tactics and preparation should always be among ND’s strengths … but for way too long now, they’ve actually been weaknesses. That trend has to end ASAP. It has been quite obvious that ND has no clue on defense, but it’s also sad to say that we’re not much better on offense. Weis cannot figure out how to score consistently when it’s first and goal. Under Holtz, if it was 1st and goal from the 7, there was no question … run for 3 yards, run for 3 yards, run for 3 yards …. TD!!! The only thing Weis’s O-line can do is pass block. Therefore, ND becomes one-dimensional in the red zone which makes it so much easier to defend.
I admire the heck out of that Navy squad. Air Force, too. If we wait long enough, Army will knock us off next year!!
By the way, I love watching Navy run offense. In this day and age when everything seems to be about the Spread, West Coast, or whatever other flashy offenses, it is great to see the Midshipmen line up and run a bunch of misdirections.
JDsays
I agree that the coaching staff should take a large part of the responsibility for the defeat at the hands of Navy on Saturday. I have not been as critical of Weiss as some of the folk on this site. The rap on Charlie was that he is an offensive genious. I am not sure of the genious part but the Irish offense is pretty darn good. I think that Weiss deserves credit for that. Clausen has also made tremendous strides as a QB over the past few years. I think Weiss also deserves some credit for that. But Saturday was a game they should have won. Did they overlook Navy to get to Pitt(if so the coach is responsible). Were they not prepared for the Navy running game(if so the coach is repsonsible). Did they make the wrong calls at the wrong times(if so the coach is responsible). I think you get the pattern. They have been a fun team to watch and are much better this year than the past 2 years. Are the ND faihtful willing to give CW 1 more year. I’m not sure. Depending on what happens over the rest of the season(at most 1 more L with a bowl win) I think he deserves it.
Wallysays
JD —
The offense has been pretty good this season, but ya gotta measure that in points scored, not yardage. To score only 21 vs Navy at home is awful. And that’s probably the main reason they lost. The total lack of a tough yardage running game really hurts inside the 10 yard line and this really hurt Saturday as it has in other losses this season. Charlie’s ND teams have never had this and probably never will, but the Nat’l title contenders all have this ability to grind it out on the ground … Florida, Texas, ‘Bama, etc.
I don’t think ND over-looked Navy, but I do think the Irish were woefully unprepared strategically on defense and also failed to adjust during the game. How a FB in the triple option can gain over 150 yards on dive plays is completely inexplicable. How there isn’t a LB zeroed in on the QB every play is inexcusable.
I think fully 1/2 of ND Nation believes Charlie should be ousted at year end, regardless of how they do in the next 3 games plus bowl game. 25% want to keep him if ND runs the table from here on out. The last 25% are willing to give him one more loss in the remaining 4 games. By the way, NDNation does not want “fun to watch” … we want to consistently win 80% of the games, give or take … that’s 9 or 10 wins a year (on the 12 game schedule). Some folks think that’s unreasonable, but I think it’s quite reasonable because a) ND has done it before and b) ND has consistently recruited Top 10 classes the past 3 years.
Crossword Petesays
Navy’s good; Unweis is TERRIBLE! Jimmy Clausen has developed DESPITE Unweis. We had an ND student at the house for dinner this week. He feels it’s more like 100% as to the percentage of students who want Unweis out. According to other dinner guests, the 1812 Overture was played twice during Saturday’s game; Unweis was booed both times! I think Wally’s guesstimate of those wanting him out is far too kind; it’s more like 75-80%, and that was BEFORE Saturday’s loss.
ND football has just hit a new low. And although he may not have been fired just yet, Charlie Weis just took one step out the door with Saturday’s unbelievable head-scratching loss to Navy. The only thing that can save him now is to win the next 3 games (at Pitt, UConn, at Stanford) AND the bowl game. But right now, the chances of that miracle happening look quite slim given the team’s morale will likely hit rock bottom right before going into a lion’s den at #13 Pittsburgh next week. And as I said prior to the season, Notre Dame would have to go at least 9-3 and look good doing it for Charlie to keep his job, especially given the relatively weak schedule. Well, the Irish (6-3) are now guaranteed to be no better than 9-3 and have actually looked bad doing it (ND could easily be 3-6). And just when Notre Dame fans think it can’t get any worse (2007 home loss to Navy), it does (2008 home loss to Syracuse), and right after we’ve picked ourselves up and dusted off, the bus runs us over again (today’s loss). Confounding home losses to far less talented teams are now Charlie’s trademark, and that is completely unacceptable. I believe that AD Jack Swarbrick will be secretly contacting the following coaches before Sunday mass: Cincinati’s Brian Kelly, Boise State’s Chris Peterson, and TCU’s Gary Patterson. Although I guess it really won’t be much of secret, will it?
Much like those Faust teams, this current Notre Dame team is a squad that never quits playing, but isn’t quite sure HOW to play. For some reason, this team’s considerable heart far exceeds its brainpower. The team that never stops fighting doesn’t know how to tackle, how to run block, or where to be during critical junctures of most games. All these shortcomings despite having a Heisman-caliber QB, a stable of outstanding receivers and generally a roster chock full of 4 and 5 star recruits most of whom are sophs, juniors and seniors. I think it’s about time to cut bait on Weis and land the next Urban Meyer before somebody else does. I don’t care if we lose some recruits and players transfer. ND should be willing to risk that because I think we’re resigned to the gut feeling that next year will be no better than this one, even if Clausen stays. And this year was supposed to be THE YEAR since the schedule was quite favorable. Heck … Michigan beat us, but has 5 losses now. Even USC is looking merely average (by USC standards) and they also beat us. And now, another loss at home to Navy!!! NAVY!!! Here’s the bottom line: If ND cannot go 10-2 this year, with this schedule, with all this talent, THEN IT’S NEVER GONNA HAPPEN WITH THIS COACHING STAFF. Time to change out the guard … I think Swarbrick is on the phone right now.
OK. I admit that I did not watch the game this week. Heck, I thought that this would be a win so I went to watch a Div II game here in my home town. I could not believe when I got home and was watching the end of the LSU-Alabama game and the score scrolled accross the bottom of the screen. I had recorded the game and went back and looked at the fourth quarter. One word – pathetic. I had predicted a 9-3 season at the beginning of the year and any less would mean that I would vote for CW to hit the road. There is no way that ND will finish this year at 9-3. We are beat down and have Pit next week. I agree with Wally that the ND AD should be on the phone looking for a new coach. I still think Jon Gruden would be a good fit. We need someone with excitement and an athletic appearance to be the coach at ND. So long Charlie!
A lot of talk about a supposed “easy schedule” really perturbed me concerning ND. I don’t know where anyone thought Navy would be easy. EXTREMELY well coached. You’re right, Wally. That loss to the Skunkbears is now more glaring of the state of Weis’ ND than any other game IMO.
Charlie is an NFL coach. In both bball and football, the pros and collegiate play is so vastly different that coaches can no longer make the swtich unless well versed in both. Charlie is an NFL groomed guy – plain and simple to me. Let’s take a look at what HAS happened during Charlie Weis’ reign:
David Cutcliffe, former Tennessee off. coord. (I think) took Duke’s program, which inherited the nation’s longest losing streak, has turned them around from an ACC laughing stock to a legitimate threat every week. They’ve crushed NC State, beat UVA and Maryland. Not exactly great, but he’s taken a team that routinely was out of the game by halftime and now sits with a winning record in conference play at 3-2.
Al Golden at Temple is being sorely overlooked for what he’s done with that basement dwelling program. He also inherited a team with the nation’s longest streak. They had virtually no recruiting. Now, he is on pace to win the conference and has the nation’s 3rd or 4th leading rusher in YPG.
These guys have done so much more with way, way less than the resources Charlie and his staff have at ND.
I would actually stay away from trying to lure Meyer from Florida. It seems like he easily snatches up all Florida talent and recruiting does itself there. Could he do that at ND? The HS talent in Florida is elite to everyone else except Texas and Cali. Maybe Skip Holtz from ECU would be a good candidate.
This was left on my FB wall: …, this is my best Village People imitation: IN THE NAVY, yes you can sail the 7 seas; IN THE NAVY, yes you can put your mind at ease; IN THE NAVY, put Notre Dame down on their knee’s; IN THE NAVY.
Wally knows that I am not a ND Alumni but I have been a huge fan for over 25 years. I guess you could call me one of the thousands and thousands that make ND a school with a true national following. My oldest daughter is a freshman at Arkansas. Maybe I should give up on ND and just become a Razorback. Things are always exciting in the SEC. Please show CW the door and get a new coaching staff before you start losing fans!
Hard for me to disagree with anything here.
This might not be the place to say it but…NAVY IS A GOOD TEAM. Let me try that again…NAVY IS A GOOD TEAM!
Don’t forget, OSU needed an interception on a 2pt. conversion to beat the Midshipmen at the Shoe. By the way, Navy gained 342 yards that day. Yes, it was split between passing and rushing, but they still gained over 300 yards. Navy beat Wake Forest two weeks ago without a pass. Before you roll your eyes, consider that the Demon Deacons have two OT losses this year (BC and Georgia Tech) and they lost by one to Miami. Navy has regularly qualified for bowls.
All that said, I have seen enough failed fades to the corner. Kel: “How many more times are they going to run that play before they realize it does not work?
The pass off Floyd’s back has to go down as one of the most frustrating ever.
Casey —
I agree that Navy is a good team. They are very well-coached, disciplined, tough, and they don’t make many mistakes. That’s almost the opposite of Notre Dame, but the Irish have so much more natural talent that they can actually stay on the field and compete with Navy. (How funny does that sound?) To be fair, I’ll also concede that the Irish have heart and don’t give up … similar to Navy. Now, if ND could possibly get the type of quality coaching that Navy has, combined with all the talent in South Bend, then the Irish would be a fixture in the Top 10 and truly competing for Nat’l Titles every third or fourth year. Sounds like the Holtz or Parseghian eras, doesn’t it?
Navy was so much better prepared to play that game yesterday than ND was …. and that’s really disappointing and unacceptable. Strategy, tactics and preparation should always be among ND’s strengths … but for way too long now, they’ve actually been weaknesses. That trend has to end ASAP. It has been quite obvious that ND has no clue on defense, but it’s also sad to say that we’re not much better on offense. Weis cannot figure out how to score consistently when it’s first and goal. Under Holtz, if it was 1st and goal from the 7, there was no question … run for 3 yards, run for 3 yards, run for 3 yards …. TD!!! The only thing Weis’s O-line can do is pass block. Therefore, ND becomes one-dimensional in the red zone which makes it so much easier to defend.
I admire the heck out of that Navy squad. Air Force, too. If we wait long enough, Army will knock us off next year!!
By the way, I love watching Navy run offense. In this day and age when everything seems to be about the Spread, West Coast, or whatever other flashy offenses, it is great to see the Midshipmen line up and run a bunch of misdirections.
I agree that the coaching staff should take a large part of the responsibility for the defeat at the hands of Navy on Saturday. I have not been as critical of Weiss as some of the folk on this site. The rap on Charlie was that he is an offensive genious. I am not sure of the genious part but the Irish offense is pretty darn good. I think that Weiss deserves credit for that. Clausen has also made tremendous strides as a QB over the past few years. I think Weiss also deserves some credit for that. But Saturday was a game they should have won. Did they overlook Navy to get to Pitt(if so the coach is responsible). Were they not prepared for the Navy running game(if so the coach is repsonsible). Did they make the wrong calls at the wrong times(if so the coach is responsible). I think you get the pattern. They have been a fun team to watch and are much better this year than the past 2 years. Are the ND faihtful willing to give CW 1 more year. I’m not sure. Depending on what happens over the rest of the season(at most 1 more L with a bowl win) I think he deserves it.
JD —
The offense has been pretty good this season, but ya gotta measure that in points scored, not yardage. To score only 21 vs Navy at home is awful. And that’s probably the main reason they lost. The total lack of a tough yardage running game really hurts inside the 10 yard line and this really hurt Saturday as it has in other losses this season. Charlie’s ND teams have never had this and probably never will, but the Nat’l title contenders all have this ability to grind it out on the ground … Florida, Texas, ‘Bama, etc.
I don’t think ND over-looked Navy, but I do think the Irish were woefully unprepared strategically on defense and also failed to adjust during the game. How a FB in the triple option can gain over 150 yards on dive plays is completely inexplicable. How there isn’t a LB zeroed in on the QB every play is inexcusable.
I think fully 1/2 of ND Nation believes Charlie should be ousted at year end, regardless of how they do in the next 3 games plus bowl game. 25% want to keep him if ND runs the table from here on out. The last 25% are willing to give him one more loss in the remaining 4 games. By the way, NDNation does not want “fun to watch” … we want to consistently win 80% of the games, give or take … that’s 9 or 10 wins a year (on the 12 game schedule). Some folks think that’s unreasonable, but I think it’s quite reasonable because a) ND has done it before and b) ND has consistently recruited Top 10 classes the past 3 years.
Navy’s good; Unweis is TERRIBLE! Jimmy Clausen has developed DESPITE Unweis. We had an ND student at the house for dinner this week. He feels it’s more like 100% as to the percentage of students who want Unweis out. According to other dinner guests, the 1812 Overture was played twice during Saturday’s game; Unweis was booed both times! I think Wally’s guesstimate of those wanting him out is far too kind; it’s more like 75-80%, and that was BEFORE Saturday’s loss.
Does anyone feel Bill Parcells or Joe Montana has a chance of being named?
Take a look at these latest odds:
https://www.playblackjack.com/prop-bets/who-will-replace-charlie-weis-at-notre-dame-bet-on-it.html